Dr. Dino in the dock

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The Pensacola News-Journal is doing fantastic work keeping us up to date on the Hovind story. A longer and more detailed story came out today. Some of the more interesting/scary bits:

Of the 58 charges, 44 were filed against Kent Hovind and his wife, Jo, for evading bank reporting requirements as they withdrew $430,500 from AmSouth Bank between July 20, 2001, and Aug. 9, 2002.

At the couple’s first court appearance Thursday before U.S. Magistrate Judge Miles Davis, Kent Hovind professed not to understand why he is being prosecuted. Some 20 supporters were in the courtroom.

“I still don’t understand what I’m being charged for and who is charging me,” he said.

Kent Hovind, who often calls himself “Dr. Dino,” has been sparring with the IRS for at least 17 years on his claims that he is employed by God, receives no income, has no expenses and owns no property.

Yet more:

The indictment also says the Hovinds’ made cash withdrawals from AmSouth Bank in a manner that evaded federal requirements for reporting cash transactions.

The withdrawals were for $9,500 or $9,600, just below the $10,000 starting point for reporting cash transactions.

Most of the withdrawals were days apart. For example, the indictment shows three withdrawals of $9,500 each on July 20, July 23 and July 26 in 2001.

The indictment also charges Kent Hovind with impeding an IRS investigation.

Among the ways he is accused of doing:

* Filing a frivolous lawsuit against the agency demanding damages for criminal trespass.

* Filing an injunction against an IRS special agent.

* Filing false complaints against the IRS for false arrest, excessive use of force and theft.

* Making threats against investigators and those cooperating with the investigation.

Judge Davis released the Hovinds from custody pending their trial, which will be scheduled during their arraignment at 2 p.m. Monday.

Over Kent Hovind’s protests, the judge took away his passport and guns Hovind claimed belonged to his church.

Although seeing “church” and “guns” in the same sentence is disturbing in itself, I don’t think we should jump to conclusions about the guns – maybe Hovind just has a deer rifle and says that all of his property, including guns, belongs to his church – but perhaps some of our legal beagle readers could see if any online legal documents have details.

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It was noted this week that Kent Hovind, creationist scammer extraordinaire, was indicted on federal charges in Florida. Hovind and his wife are charged with 58 counts in the indictment:Of the 58 charges, 44 were filed against Kent Hovind and Read More

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And once again, our friends at Uncommonly Dense are on the wrong side of things.

April 18, 2006 Help Save Dinosaur Adventure Land

The authorities in Pensacola, Florida are trying to bulldoze Kent Hovind’s Dinosaur Adventure Land over a building permit dispute. The buildings are all up to code, inspected and found sound, and have stood since 2002 through some of the worst hurricanes Florida has seen in decades.

What is WRONG with everyone? I don’t believe people and dinosaurs lived together like the Flintstones but I sure as heck don’t think a theme park that purports that they did should be shut down because of how fashionalbe it is to bust chops on Christian young earth creationists. This really sucks. I can hardly believe this is the same country I defended in the Marine Corps 30 years ago. I’ve been to Disneyland many times and there’s sure a lot of as-authentic-as-can-be fantasy themes there. This is no different except the theme is young earth creation science and a famous young earth creationist owns the park.

Tell them how you feel. Click here to learn how to help. Filed under: Intelligent Design — DaveScot @ 12:16 am

No, I really do dislike big gov’t. It’s out of control. Hovind is taking a stand on principle. Good for him. You act like he’s trying to murder unborn babies without a license or something. He’s harming no one and minding his own business. -ds

DaveScot has difficulty with abstract concepts like, oh, laws.

He’s harming no one and minding his own business.

Denying the Earth’s age is ok. Ignoring decades worth of scientific research is ok. Being a fundamentalist nut-job is ok. Lying to children is ok. But f*** with the IRS and your ass is history.

P.S. I wonder if/when UD will chime in on Hovind’s latest persecution, erp, prosecution.

What I always find somewhat disconcerting is how much tax evasion someone can actually get away with before the IRS finally takes action. Almost as though it’s OK to evade even an enormous tax burden *unless* you are wanted for some other crime, or unless you flaunt your evasion publicly, bragging about it in books, websites, speeches, etc. Hovind’s bogus claim that he is a church, so his personal income is tax-free (and not his; it belongs to God and Hovind only gets to spend it), seems to have served him well (i.e. taxless) for his entire adult life.

This is surely just another episode in the running battle between Hovind (who hasn’t paid any taxes in at least 17 years) and the IRS (which hasn’t managed to collect any), and I predict that the IRS will someday within the next few years find Hovind guilty of these counts, fine him something nowhere near close to what he actually owes, and Hovind will refuse to pay and appeal, making sure no funds can be traced. While the appeals wander around the interminable judicial Foggy Bottom, Hovind will continue publishing, speaking, and collecting donations which will promptly vanish into the laundry while Hovind continues to live, uh, in notable comfort. Probably as long as he lives.

Nor do I think Dinosaur Adventure Land is entirely history. It will get renamed, relocated, reburied in accounting shells inside shells. I’m just too cynical to think Hovind is too poor to buy the justice he desires, despite his claims of being penniless. Hovind is a famous Man of God, and the IRS will treat this case very gingerly.

Hovind’s “defense” vis DScot is rather like the ploy of being ordained in the Universal Life Church, the better to avoid drug laws.

steve s Wrote:
Uncommon Descent Wrote:

The buildings are all up to code, inspected and found sound

Question, have in fact fire and building code inspections been performed on the building that they’ve been refusing to pay for the permit on?

No, the problem here, as Dave Scott sees it, is that the courts don’t recognize the possibility of supernatural intervention.

You see, science is just the beginning. Next comes the notion of the Intelligent Intervener in criminal matters. You laugh, but that is what the wedge strategy document implies.

The indictment and the motion to seal the indictment (= keep it secret) are available on PACER. I quote the motion to seal:

Case 3:06-cr-00083-MCR Document 1 Filed 07/11/2006

IN THE UNITED STATE DISTRICT COURT FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA PENSACOLA DIVISION UNITED STATES OF AMERICA v. KENT E. HOVIND and JO D. HOVIND

MOTION REQUESTING AN ORDER SEALING INDICTMENT

The United States of America, by and through the undersigned Assistant United States Attorney, requests this Court to issue an Order sealing the indictment returned by the grand jury in this case, and in support of this motion states as follows:

1. The United States has reason to believe that the arrest of the defendants in this case could pose some danger to agents. Kent Hovind is a fundamentalist religious leader who lives and works in a protected compound on Old Palafox Road with his followers. According to reliable sources, he has access to weapons in the compound. Because the Hovinds don not recognize the authority of the United States, it is believed he would not be cooperative in any scenario created to take his wife and him into custody, including self-surrender. Prior notification of the arrest by the revelation of the indictment could give the compound occupants and opportunity to prevent the arrest, which could pose a threat of harm to agents, occupants and surrounding neighbors.

2. The arrests are currently scheduled to occur within one week of indictment.

3. The United States further moves the Court that the indictment in this case and this motion remain sealed until further Order of this Court, except that the Clerk’s Office shall provide two certified copies of the indictment to the United States Attorney for the Northern District of Florida and two certified copies to the United States Marshal for the Northern District of Florida.

WHEREFORE, for the reasons stated above, the United States respectfully requests that this Court seal the indictment until arrests are made.

Respectfully submitted,

GREGORY R. MILLER UNITED STATES ATTORNEY

MICHELLE M. HELDMEYER (addresses and stuff)

DONE AND ORDERED this the 11th day of July, 2006.

signed UNITED STATES MAGISTRATE JUDGE

So they sealed the indictment to make sure Hovind didn’t know about it ahead of time, because there was some fear he wouldn’t come quietly. The newspaper article shows that he did come quietly, of course, but still somewhat disturbing.

No, I really do dislike big gov’t. It’s out of control. Hovind is taking a stand on principle. Good for him. You act like he’s trying to murder unborn babies without a license or something. He’s harming no one and minding his own business. -ds

Splendid. So if DaveScot were to discover I was a member of, say, the ACLU, he’d applaud this because I’d “be taking a stand on principle”. Nice that DS is internally consistent.

Thank goodness Dave never learned to think before he rants.

Chiefly has alluded to Hovind’s defense already.

The guy will have no problems, his whole case is completely water tight, he is employed by [Enable javascript to see this email address.].

All he has to do is call HIM as a witness and get HIM to clear this whole stupid mess up.

I see it now. IRS attorney: Would you state for the record your full name. GOD: Mr God. IRS: And your address Mr God ? GOD: Currently?… no fixed abode Sir. IRS: Well how about some proof of identity, say an old phone bill with your name on it. GOD: Ah well, you see Sir, I never had a phone. IRS: OK then, how about a birth certificate? GOD: No can do there, Sir. IRS: So no proof you are a citizen of the USA? GOD: Nope. IRS: Your Honor I move that the witness be dismissed. His/Her Honor: The witness is dismissed.

I don’t know the whole story, but the IRS is a lame lame lame agency, and I can see myself hating them and fighting them too. I wouldn’t do it like Hovind, saying that I’m and employee of God (damn, that’s dumb). But I’d fight them just the same (if I had any bleeding money.)

Arden Chatfield Wrote:

Nice that DS is internally consistent.

What’s most amusing to me that in the Uncommon Descent post from April, they asserted with no links offered that the authorities were trying to “bulldoze” dinosaur adventure land. Whereas as today’s news article tells us, what actually happened in April was:

In April, Circuit Judge Michael Allen ordered the buildings at Dinosaur Adventure Land closed because Hovind failed to obtain a building permit during the 2002 construction. The outdoor theme park was allowed to stay open…

While the building permit case was tied up in a four-year court battle, ownership of the theme park was turned over to Glen Stoll, who works with Hovind on legal issues and is based in Washington.

Hm. Maybe they were like invisible bulldozers that only those whose senses are finely attuned to detecting design can see.

Ya know, the IRS is giving me a whole bunch of crap because they misplaced some of the paperwork they acknowledge I sent them. Go figure.

Which reminds me, have to fax this stuff to them, again.

Now I work on the defense side of things so I can assure you that God would NEVER answer a subpoena to be a witness for Rev. H. Can you imagine how many outstanding warrants that punk has out for him on the basis of his followers’ books alone? Not to mention more modern stuff that he’s going to have to answer for. No sir, the only way they’ll ever get old god on the stand is if he takes the form of a black man behind the wheel of a nice car in ahywhere USA, and he’ll get Gitmo’d so fast we’ll never hear about it.

He doesn’t recognise the authority of the United States? So who issued his passport? I didn’t know God was in the business of issuing US passports.

Seems he recognises the authority of the United States when it suits him. If he wants to go on lecture tours abroad, he recognises the authority of the US government by applying for a passport. But when it comes to paying taxes, all of a sudden things are different.

IRS attorney: Would you state for the record your full name.” GOD: Mr Damnit. God Damnit. Middle initial F.

Thanks to Martin Mull.

“The withdrawals were for $9,500 or $9,600, just below the $10,000 starting point for reporting cash transactions.”

“I still don’t understand what I’m being charged for and who is charging me,” he said.

Dr. Dino, You’re charged with smurfing. How ironic.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smurfing_(crime)

There are probable a number of real legal loop-holes that would allow him to mask his personal assets under the guise of a tax-exempt church which he runs; however there are definitely limits and he has definitely crossed them:

Tax exempt status does not apply to the employees of a tax exempt organization. This appears to be primarily where the half a million dollar charge comes from.

Tax exempt status does not automatically apply to all property or business run by such an organization. “Dinosaur Adventure Land” is not tax exempt even if his church is.

Oh and according to at least one source I read he refused to get construction permits because that went against his “deeply held religious beliefs”.

Here is a guy who tried to declare bankruptcy while there was a couple hundred thousand in the bank.

I would think the more religious you are the more you would be offended by someone trying to misuse the exemptions granted religion so badly.

You’ll never manage to subpoena God, he’s in hiding over that creation scandal. When last reached for comment he said:

“I didn’t do. Nobody saw me do it. You can’t prove anything.” - God

By not properly tracking or making Social Security payments, he’s messing around with his employees’ retirement benefits.

“I still don’t understand what I’m being charged for and who is charging me,” he [Hovind] said.

Neck-deep in denial until the bitter end…

Tax exempt status does not apply to the employees of a tax exempt organization. This appears to be primarily where the half a million dollar charge comes from.

I think the Official Excuse is that he is unpaid. All income is made by the Church. He is a volunteer worker whose job is to allocate church funds. He allocates some of those to supporting his lifestyle. But he himself has no money at all…

A general Hovind question: Does anyone know about the validity of his claim to have taught high school science? None of Hovind’s academic credentials are from accredited schools (except his high school diploma, if he has one). I don’t know about Florida, but here in Canada you need at least a bachelor’s degree to teach at a public school. So I can’t see how a school board would hire him, unless he worked at a private school or one that hires outside the teacher’s union.

Hovind taught at a few Christian schools, but never for very long at any one school. He never taught at a public school.

It should be perhaps pointed out that Hovind and his, uh “tax lawyer” are both longtime “tax protestors”, a segment of the lunatic “patriot militia” movement that, among other things, was Timothy McVeigh’s entry into the lunatic right-wing.

Hovind has loony militia connections right up to his eyebrows, and many of his idiotic conspiracy theories – “the government blew up the Oklahoma City building so it could blame the militias”, “the government is spying on us through our TV sets” – are lifted, word ofr word, from the militia kooks.

Of course, LOTS of fundie fruitcakes (such as Pat Robertson and Jack van Impe) were making nice-nice with the militia nutters, right up till the Oklahoma City bombing and all those resulting Congressional hearings. Then, for some odd reason, they all of a sudden fell all over themsleves to distance themselves from their former militia friends.

Trace Hovind’s various connections to their source, and you will get a very good thumbnail education in the far-right lunatic fringe, and where the fundies fit into it.

Glen Stoll, who works with Hovind on legal issues

You would, of course, think from this statement that Stoll is a tax laywer. And you’d be wrong. He’s, uh, not. Indeed, he’s not even a lawyer AT ALL.

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE WEDNESDAY, JULY 6, 2005 WWW.USDOJ.GOV

COURT BARS WASHINGTON STATE TAX SCAM

Edmonds Man Sold Phony Trusts

WASHINGTON, D.C. - The Justice Department announced today that a federal court in Seattle has permanently barred Glen Stoll, of Edmonds, Washington, and two of his businesses, “Nonprofit Commercial Enterprises” and “Director and General Counsel for Remedies at Law,” from selling tax-fraud schemes that use sham trusts to help customers evade federal income taxes. In entering the order, Judge Ricardo S. Martinez of the U.S. District Court for the Western District of Washington also ordered Stoll to provide the government his customers’ names, mailing and e-mail addresses, telephone and Social Security numbers, and to post a copy of the injunction order on his website.

The court found that Stoll, who falsely claimed to be a lawyer, and his businesses sell a fraudulent “corporation sole” and “ministerial trust” scheme, falsely telling customers that conducting their business activities and funding their lifestyles through a so-called ministerial trust eliminates their obligations to file federal tax returns and pay federal tax. The court found that one customer, after being contacted by the IRS for an audit, voluntarily filed two delinquent tax returns showing more than $40,000 in taxes due. The court also found that despite IRS audits of many of the defendants’ customers, the defendants continued to promote the fraudulent scheme, for which they charged at least $4,000, plus $120 for seminars and hourly consulting fees.

http://www.usdoj.gov/tax/txdv05362.htm

So at least “Dr” Hovind won’t be alone in his Federal cell.

(snicker) (giggle)

Although seeing “church” and “guns” in the same sentence is disturbing in itself, I don’t think we should jump to conclusions about the guns

Well, if you knew who Hovind’s friends are, you’d ABSOLUTELY jump to that conclusion.

Just like the Feds did. They asked to keep the indictment secret from Hovind because they were afraid he’d resist. In his, uh, “compound”. …

I never cease to be amazed at the brazen audacity with which fundies adhere to the “I’m a Christian, the rules don’t apply to me” attitude. Perhaps the pathetic way they follow up with their second favorite whine: “They’re persecuting me, and all I did was break the law! But I’m not like other people!”

I think the word for all of this is schadenfreude. It’s just been all too awesome.

The church of “Dr. Dino” resides in a compound where weapons are stocked? Sounds more like a cult than a church! In fact, it’s more along the line of the People’s Temple and the Branch Davidians! And no doubt Hovind is their Rev. Jim Jones and David Koresh!

Barbara R.

Barbara Rainey Wrote:

In fact, it’s more along the line of the People’s Temple and the Branch Davidians! And no doubt Hovind is their Rev. Jim Jones and David Koresh!

Well, except for the part about using a position of power to seduce underaged girls. And the part about forcibly compelling others to commit mutual suicide. And also when they came to arrest him and took away his gun[s] so he wouldn’t use them to resist arrest, Kent Hovind actually let himself be arrested and defended himself with merely a bunch of near-fraudulent legal arguments and evasion techniques, instead of doing what the Branch Davidians did and using said guns to shoot the investigators.

So, if we judge someone by the good or ill they perform in the world, then I guess we must conclude Kent Hovind is a better person than David Koresh. Though, checking Google, I find apparently this doesn’t stop Hovind from being something of a fan..?

Kent Hovind, 'Unmasking the False Religion of Evolution' Wrote:

Chapter 4 Evolution, the Foundation For Communism, Nazism and Socialism … Communists have explicit guidelines for revolution. Listed below are the guidelines they use when they want to take over a country.

Communist Guidelines for Revolution … 8. Cause the registration of all firearms. Do you know this is one of the communist plans to take control of the country? Register all firearms. That has been a reoccurring theme throughout history. That’s what Lenin called for, to disarm the people. That’s what Adolf Hitler wanted. Did you know that Adolf Hitler’s gun control law, WORD FOR WORD, almost made it through our senate and house of representatives a couple of years ago? It would have become law here in the United States. Hitler required that you register your firearms. Joseph Stalin wanted registration of all firearms. GUN CONTROL! That is what the Branch Davidian compound attack was all about. David Koresh was a gun collector and a tax evader. Boy, they didn’t like him, and one of the purposes for that raid was to scare the American people into submission. You better register your firearms. Make sure they know. They might come for you as they did for Koresh.

Chapter 6 Questions and Answers

Question. What really happened to David Koresh?

There is no question that the guy was a screwball and a cult leader, but do you know who really attacked the Koresh cult? Did you know that the black suited organization that attacked the Koresh cult was a United Nations task force? There is a United Nations task force, including 300,000 foreign troops in America. Their job is to be prepared to put down resistance and rebellion, especially among cults. If you happen to believe the Bible, send your children to a Christian school, rebel, hoard guns, ammunition or food, or are nervous about the government, you are considered to be a dangerous cult in their minds…

Did you know that the black suited organization that attacked the Koresh cult was a United Nations task force? There is a United Nations task force, including 300,000 foreign troops in America. Their job is to be prepared to put down resistance and rebellion, especially among cults. If you happen to believe the Bible, send your children to a Christian school, rebel, hoard guns, ammunition or food, or are nervous about the government, you are considered to be a dangerous cult in their minds…

This, of course, is all standard “militia” boilerplate.

Black helicopters, UN troops, the whole works.

Perhaps that is why Hovind declares:

“Democracy is evil and contrary to God’s law.” (http://www.splcenter.org/intel/inte[…].jsp?aid=205)

Re “If you happen to believe the Bible, send your children to a Christian school, rebel, hoard guns, ammunition or food, or are nervous about the government, you are considered to be a dangerous cult in their minds…”

Offhand, the “rebel, hoard guns, ammunition” part does strike me as indicating that somebody is dangerous. Not the first two points or the food. As for nervous about the government - right now that may be large fraction of the country.

Henry

OT: Does anyone else find it a bit comical that a biology professor at a backwoods Minnesota college claims you can’t believe in God and be a scientist, too?

Not sure I’ve ever seen a biology professor say “you can’t believe in God and be a scientist, too.”

But if you have a reference, I’ll be glad to take a look.

Hovind writes, “Did you know that Adolf Hitler’s gun control law, WORD FOR WORD, almost made it through our senate and house of representatives a couple of years ago?”

That’s a pretty neat trick, considering that any German gun control law would be written in, well, German, and any ‘word for word’ version in English would be pretty incomprehensible.

He doesn’t recognise the authority of the United States? So who issued his passport? I didn’t know God was in the business of issuing US passports.

IIRC he has a Florida passport. Which he claims means that he’s got nothing to do with the USA, no sirree.

Since on, I think, two occasions Kent has submitted documents to the court claiming to not be a citizen of the US or the state of FL, why does he need a US passport, which the judge confiscated? It will be interesting to see if he cancels his travel schedule or whether his son, Eric, picks up the slack. Based upon the brief statement in the Pensacola News, he was apparently pretty upset with the judge for preventing him from going to South Africa by taking his passport.

On the issue of the building permits and code violations, Kent had non-government inspectors look at his illegal buildings and apparently they may be up to code, but Kent believes any government mandated permits, codes and inspectors are a form of taxation and government intrusion into churches. He would not let the official inspectors on “church” property or pay the $50 permit fee. Kent apparently does not believe in paying any taxes despite enjoying the relatively peaceful and prosperous society they help maintain. He claims to have spent over $400,000 defending himself over the matter of the building permits. That is suspiciously close to the amount the court indictment says he and his wife snuck out of the bank. Connection, fable or coincidence?

In Dover, PA, I heard him tell the audience that they should have the right to specify what their children are taught since they pay taxes. That always seemed like a bit of the hypocrite talking, but maybe “men of God” (at least like him) should be allowed a lower standard of behavior than us regular sinners, because their work is so important.

Kent Hovind Wrote:

Did you know that the black suited organization that attacked the Koresh cult was a United Nations task force? There is a United Nations task force, including 300,000 foreign troops in America. Their job is to be prepared to put down resistance and rebellion, especially among cults.

That shit is just insane. The UN employs less people world wide than Saatchi & Saatchi and has an operating budget less than that which Americans spend on flowers each year (“We Did Nothing,” Linda Polman, 2003).

Where are these troops coming from? China? Russia? Who the hell else can stump up 300,000 troops?

I can’t believe someone can hold such a thought in their head at the same time as not being considered legally insane.

Tangentially related, but I recall hearing that after WW2 they worked out that you needed something like a ratio of one occupying soldier to 20 civilians to keep a country quiet under occupation. So that means Hovinds 300,000 needs to be more like 13 million.

guthrie Wrote:

Tangentially related, but I recall hearing that after WW2 they worked out that you needed something like a ratio of one occupying soldier to 20 civilians to keep a country quiet under occupation. So that means Hovinds 300,000 needs to be more like 13 million.

Taking the tangent even further, I’m pretty sure that applies to countries with a degree of civil infrastructure and order in the first place. Which makes the 150,000 soldiers or so used in Iraq the laughably small number I’ve always said it was - at least a million would be needed to pacify such a country. Hiding in bases and setting up the odd checkpoint was a useless venture from the start. Soldiers would be needed on virtually every street corner.

And I am - or at least, was - a supporter of the war. Only in a general “rather it wasn’t done like this but I suppose it accomplishes a good cause” sense though, I admit.

It’s a great time to see the interview where Ali G “interviewed” Kent Hovind again. Hovind was completely unaware that Ali G was mocking him and took it all very seriously.

Kent Hovind Interviewed by Ali G

Ali G, for those who don’t know, is a British Jew called Sacha Baron Cohen who is quite highly educated but parodies the street culture of certain British Afro-Carribean youths (or rather, white British middle-class stereotypes of them).

This interview is truly hilarious.

Stephen Erickson Wrote:

OT: Does anyone else find it a bit comical that a biology professor at a backwoods Minnesota college claims you can’t believe in God and be a scientist, too?

I wasn’t aware that public college mainstream science differed, no matter whether it is backwoods or concrete urban.

Remember when going for health care-your hospital lab tech might just be from a “backwoods Minnesota college”.

Comment #112437

Posted by Mephisto on July 15, 2006 01:00 PM (e) | kill

It’s a great time to see the interview where Ali G “interviewed” Kent Hovind again. Hovind was completely unaware that Ali G was mocking him and took it all very seriously.

Kent Hovind Interviewed by Ali G

I generally think it’s a waste of time to talk to someone as bonkers as Kent Hovind (or our resident Kent, AFDave http://www.antievolution.org/cgi-bi[…]1958;st=3210), but Ali G does it right.

Matt pointed out a while back that because Kent had disclaimed his citizenship, then his possession of firearms is a felony. I wonder if they’ll add this charge on?

Anybody know anybody at the ATF?

I feel sorry for Jo Hovind, though. In my extensive experience with poor southern kooks, it’s usually the husband who gets obsessed with some idiotic belief system (focusing on the UN / Bilderbergs / Satanic Cults / etc) and slowly, gradually, the wife follows where the husband leads.

I’m not saying Jo started out as Miss Rationalist, but she probably wouldn’t be facing tax charges and such without Kent.

steve s Wrote:

Comment #112521 Posted by steve s on July 15, 2006 09:05 PM (e)

I feel sorry for Jo Hovind, though. In my extensive experience with poor southern kooks, it’s usually the husband who gets obsessed with some idiotic belief system (focusing on the UN / Bilderbergs / Satanic Cults / etc) and slowly, gradually, the wife follows where the husband leads.

I’m not saying Jo started out as Miss Rationalist, but she probably wouldn’t be facing tax charges and such without Kent..

I thought Kent Hovind is from Illinois? His accent is not what I would call southern but Midwestern. Anyway, Kent is a kook extraordinaire and the sad part is that he seems un-remorseful in dragging his poor wife down into the drain with himself.

OT: Does anyone else find it a bit comical that a biology professor at a backwoods Minnesota college claims you can’t believe in God and be a scientist, too?

No. Do you have anything to offer us other than geographical bigotry and a lack of awareness of the ranking of The University of Minnesota-Morris as an undergraduate liberal arts educational institution?

OT: Does anyone else find it a bit comical that a biology professor at a backwoods Minnesota college claims you can’t believe in God and be a scientist, too?

I always find it extremely comical no matter WHO says it.

;>

Hey, wait a minute.

If he’s been withdrawing his money in a suspicious or illegal fashion, if he has unregistered weaponry and if he’s made statements attempting to alter the purpose of the United States government…

… why is he not up on terrorism charges instead of just tax avoidance?

And he is, clearly, completely batnuts. If he claims “believing in the Bible” is enough in the U.S. to be labelled a “dangerous cult”…

You see, science is just the beginning. Next comes the notion of the Intelligent Intervener in criminal matters. You laugh, but that is what the wedge strategy document implies.

I’m betting the next step is witchcraft trials. Every time a fundie wingnut chokes on something (or gets caught “praying” with/on an underage student or intern), someone will be accused of using Satanic powers to make it happen.

Comment #112194

Posted by Jason on July 14, 2006 01:41 PM (e)

I don’t know the whole story, but the IRS is a lame lame lame agency, and I can see myself hating them and fighting them too. I wouldn’t do it like Hovind, saying that I’m and employee of God (damn, that’s dumb). But I’d fight them just the same (if I had any bleeding money.)

Do. You. Even. Have. A. Clue? The IRS is an easy target, but they’re not exactly the problem.

Comment #112217

Posted by Alann on July 14, 2006 03:42 PM (e)

There are probable a number of real legal loop-holes that would allow him to mask his personal assets under the guise of a tax-exempt church which he runs; however there are definitely limits and he has definitely crossed them:

Not really. Substance, sham and fraudulent conveyance doctrines easily over-ride those games. To be real, you must be real.

Tax exempt status does not apply to the employees of a tax exempt organization. This appears to be primarily where the half a million dollar charge comes from.

You’d be surprised how many church’s cheat. It’s gross, which is why I don’t do church’s or preachers. They are, by far, the most likely to get your office raided by IRS CID and your records (and computers) hauled off during subpoena/warrant actions.

Tax exempt status does not automatically apply to all property or business run by such an organization. “Dinosaur Adventure Land” is not tax exempt even if his church is.

Yes, it’s called “Unrelated Business Gross Income” and requires a Form 990-T filing.

I would think the more religious you are the more you would be offended by someone trying to misuse the exemptions granted religion so badly.

Most of the ones that cheat like that have already surrounded themselves with like-minded individuals. In these cases it’s pitched as martyrdom, not criminality.

OT: Does anyone else find it a bit comical that a biology professor at a backwoods Minnesota college claims you can’t believe in God and be a scientist, too?

I always find it extremely comical no matter WHO says it.

Troll mating sighted.

Communist Guidelines for Revolution … 8. Cause the registration of all firearms. Do you know this is one of the communist plans to take control of the country? Register all firearms. That has been a reoccurring theme throughout history. That’s what Lenin called for, to disarm the people. That’s what Adolf Hitler wanted.

Hitler was a Communist? Ah, so that explains the Treaty of Nonaggression between Germany and the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. I guess they registered each others’ guns, or something. Though it didn’t keep them from shooting the crap out of each other along the Eastern Front.

Troll mating sighted.

Dick waving ignored.

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This page contains a single entry by Nick Matzke published on July 14, 2006 11:41 AM.

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