Introduction to Genetics and Evolution

| 86 Comments

Mohamed Noor, who got his Ph.D. under Jerry Coyne, is teaching an online introduction to genetics and evolution. It starts Oct 10 and is free. Strongly recommended for FL and Byers.

Hat tip to Florida Citizens for Science

86 Comments

I suggest that we ask every troll who infests these boards questions from this series every time they show up. If they are not here to learn science they should be ignored.

DS said:

I suggest that we ask every troll who infests these boards questions from this series every time they show up. If they are not here to learn science they should be ignored.

I strongly concur. (I’ve regretfully decided not to sign up for Oct. 10, because it looks like material I’m already familiar with, and although review is always a good thing, I’m very, very busy these days.)

Back in 1999, when I first learned about creationists, my instinctive response was to ask them if they actually knew anything about the subject they were denying.

It’s been thirteen years now, and I have literally never seen an ID/creationist express a fair understanding of the theory of evolution at the most basic level.

Yep. They can’t accurately describe evolution for sure.

Of course, they will assume that they already know everything about what is in the class. Most of them would assume that they could teach it. They would all be wrong, but they can’t understand that. Self reflection is not a skill they have.

I love coursera.org! It’s such a great idea and totally free. I think I’ll sign up for this one.

harold said:

DS said:

I suggest that we ask every troll who infests these boards questions from this series every time they show up. If they are not here to learn science they should be ignored.

I strongly concur. (I’ve regretfully decided not to sign up for Oct. 10, because it looks like material I’m already familiar with, and although review is always a good thing, I’m very, very busy these days.)

Back in 1999, when I first learned about creationists, my instinctive response was to ask them if they actually knew anything about the subject they were denying.

It’s been thirteen years now, and I have literally never seen an ID/creationist express a fair understanding of the theory of evolution at the most basic level.

Yup, I strongly second. However, I doubt RBH’s sound advice will be heeded by Booby Byers and FL. I think I can bet a bank on that.

I wonder if a lot of creationists (all varieties) will sign up just so they can flood the discussion area with stupid anti-evolution comments?

John said: Yup, I strongly second. However, I doubt RBH’s sound advice will be heeded by Booby Byers and FL. I think I can bet a bank on that.

As long as it isn’t the “tangled bank” from the closing paragraph of Origin of Species because they’ll just fixate on the reference to “the Creator”.

The intro video looks great. I am pleased that the course will concentrate on genetics. Now I wonder what objection the trolls could possibly have to that. What excuse could they possibly come up with for not wanting to understand basic genetic mechanisms? The only thing I can think of is that is won’t allow them to keep making the same ignorant arguments that they have been parroting without comprehension for many years.

Booby Byers and Fatuous Floyd have no interest in learning anything about evolution. Their minds are made up, the facts are irrelevant.

John said:

harold said:

DS said:

I suggest that we ask every troll who infests these boards questions from this series every time they show up. If they are not here to learn science they should be ignored.

I strongly concur. (I’ve regretfully decided not to sign up for Oct. 10, because it looks like material I’m already familiar with, and although review is always a good thing, I’m very, very busy these days.)

Back in 1999, when I first learned about creationists, my instinctive response was to ask them if they actually knew anything about the subject they were denying.

It’s been thirteen years now, and I have literally never seen an ID/creationist express a fair understanding of the theory of evolution at the most basic level.

Yup, I strongly second. However, I doubt RBH’s sound advice will be heeded by Booby Byers and FL. I think I can bet a bank on that.

SLC said:

Booby Byers and Fatuous Floyd have no interest in learning anything about evolution. Their minds are made up, the facts are irrelevant.

Of course. C’est vrai! Why would anyone who is reasonably intelligent think otherwise?

It sounds great.

My issues though are with the nature of the course; videos and quizzes? I suppose I should not complain, the course is free. But there are better ways to do a course.

Tim

D.S said “Now I wonder what objection the trolls could possibly have to that. “ Well look on the Florida Citizens for Science web site and the exchange between Chris and Ivorygirl. Ivorygirl to Chris(who is a creationist) “I’m sure you have genetics all figured out. Just place a few colored sticks in front of some mating goats and bingo! the offspring come out striped. Who needs science when you have a three thousand year old book written by a bunch of Bronze Age goat herders, right?”

Well, I’m signed up. I’m betting lots of creationists will sign up solely to post creo-crap on the course forum. I’m sure it’s going to require a lot of moderation to separate the sincere questions from the creationist trick questions.

Kevin B said:

John said: Yup, I strongly second. However, I doubt RBH’s sound advice will be heeded by Booby Byers and FL. I think I can bet a bank on that.

As long as it isn’t the “tangled bank” from the closing paragraph of Origin of Species because they’ll just fixate on the reference to “the Creator”.

Given the intellectual poverty of their minds, I was thinking of any bank in Athens, Greece.

My issues though are with the nature of the course; videos and quizzes? I suppose I should not complain, the course is free. But there are better ways to do a course.

Yes, but it is an online course–what do you want? For their programming/database courses they have programming environments where you can run your queries or whatever and get your results evaluated for correctness. It’s very well done.

Wish we could sign the IDM up for this evo course.

Karen S. said:

Well, I’m signed up. I’m betting lots of creationists will sign up solely to post creo-crap on the course forum. I’m sure it’s going to require a lot of moderation to separate the sincere questions from the creationist trick questions.

It’s actually an interesting question.

On one hand, any serious discussion of science is a creationist repellent. They literally almost never comment on the threads here that discuss something technical, for example.

On the other hand, I suppose they could avoid the actual content, and jump straight to sabotaging a discussion forum.

Genetics is not my thing. In fact it’s to me a very off-broadway subject in origin issues. The big problem with it is that they can’t imagine genetics has within it the power to genetically change itself. As long as its a fixed thing then error slips in.

for example i’m sure marsupials are just placentals with pouches. so the common genetic points all marsupials share are just from a common generic change that happened to them all upon migrating to certain areas. The genetics is not a sign of being of one tribe as evolution now teaches. Genetics are not a trail of biological heritage.

likewise I’m sure that people leaving Babel and entering Africa instantly or within years had become black etc. not their kids byt themselves in order for their skin to deal with the sun/heat/humidity etc. likewise people entering Europe lost instantly pigmentation . It was a genetic change, from some trigger, and everyone now has these genetic markers. Genetic studies are still new and can’t rule out genetics has hidden abilities to change itself based on deeper biological laws.

Robert Byers said:

Genetics is not my thing. In fact it’s to me a very off-broadway subject in origin issues.

** Jazz~Hands!! **

But seriously, I haven’t seen Cats or Blue Man Group. I need to get out more.

Genetics are not a trail of biological heritage.

Which is why DNA tests are not permitted to be used as evidence in a court of law. Thank you, Robert.

The power of DNA sidelined with, ‘Genetics is not my thing’. It is life you twit! It is the chemical code which makes stupid you, you! What is, your ‘thing’? No toilet humour please:)

I’ve signed up for the course. Not being sciency it will be a no pressure, interesting, useful, use of my time.

‘Genetics is not my thing.’! Perhaps the stupidest internet posting since the beginning of the inter-net; and by a christian who prances about naked claiming he has clothes; delicious!

Ignorance really is bliss, isn’t it?

Robert Byers said:

Genetics is not my thing. In fact it’s to me a very off-broadway subject in origin issues. The big problem with it is that they can’t imagine genetics has within it the power to genetically change itself. As long as its a fixed thing then error slips in.

for example i’m sure marsupials are just placentals with pouches. so the common genetic points all marsupials share are just from a common generic change that happened to them all upon migrating to certain areas. The genetics is not a sign of being of one tribe as evolution now teaches. Genetics are not a trail of biological heritage.

likewise I’m sure that people leaving Babel and entering Africa instantly or within years had become black etc. not their kids byt themselves in order for their skin to deal with the sun/heat/humidity etc. likewise people entering Europe lost instantly pigmentation . It was a genetic change, from some trigger, and everyone now has these genetic markers. Genetic studies are still new and can’t rule out genetics has hidden abilities to change itself based on deeper biological laws.

It’s like heroin addiction. For those experiencing the high, it’s bliss. For those observing the effects, it’s something else again.

Robert Byers said: …i’m sure marsupials are just placentals with pouches.

Actually placentals are just marsupials with better/bigger placentas and uterii.

So, tell us, Robert - how many different species of marsupials were on Noah’s Ark - and how did they store all the fresh eucalyptus leaves?

Robert Byers said:

Genetics is not my thing.

there - fixed that comment for you - now it is factual

I just signed up. Hope to see some of you there, especially those of you whose understanding of biology (science in general) is, how shall I say, lacking. Just behave better than you did in high school, please.…

Well here is your chance Bobby boy. Sign up for the course and learn something. Either that or be revealed as the willfully ignorant fool that you are. No one cares about your ignorant opinions. If you want to disrespect everyone here, just keep spouting off without a clue what you are talking about. If you refuse to even try to learn anything then you will condemn yourself to a life of ignorance. Do you really want everyone to know that a YEC isn’t even interested in learn anything about reality? Don’t get me wrong, we all know it already. But now you will give everyone the opportunity to point at you an laugh because you were offered the opportunity to learn and you declined. How do you think you are going to convince anyone who actually took the course and now knows more than you that you are right about anything? And by the way Bobby, there are people posting here who has extensive backgrounds in genetics. There are people posting here who could teach such courses. You don’t come off very well to them either. Get a clue or hit the road, your comedic value has ended.

This particular comment I am not directing towards Mr. Byers, but can be instructional as to the mindset of a creationist. Actually a microcosmic summary of the entire ID/Creationist ‘argument’

Robert Byers said:

Genetics is not my thing.

ok we knew this part- ID/Creationists are not scientists, they don’t use/value the scientific method.

In fact it’s to me a very off-broadway subject in origin issues. The big problem with it is that they can’t imagine genetics has within it the power to genetically change itself. As long as its a fixed thing then error slips in.

after admitting ignorance and lack of interest in how genetics actually works the creationist then makes several assertions as if he were an expert in the subject.

for example i’m sure marsupials are just placentals with pouches. so the common genetic points all marsupials share are just from a common generic change that happened to them all upon migrating to certain areas. The genetics is not a sign of being of one tribe as evolution now teaches. Genetics are not a trail of biological heritage.

more assertions as if from authority, in reality evidence that the creationist knows nothing about genetics (yet still believes he is justified in critiquing it)

likewise I’m sure that people leaving Babel and entering Africa instantly or within years had become black etc. not their kids by themselves in order for their skin to deal with the sun/heat/humidity etc. likewise people entering Europe lost instantly pigmentation . It was a genetic change, from some trigger, and everyone now has these genetic markers.

here we see a particular type of creationist assertion, the young earth creationist flavor of argument or YEC. The assumption that events in the Bible are factual and historically accurate and spinning tales around them (how Africans became black) here we also see invocation of long dismissed/disproven scientific-type claims (inheiritance of aquiried traits as Lararck described adaptation)

Genetic studies are still new and can’t rule out genetics has hidden abilities to change itself based on deeper biological laws.

and finally the critisism of science as somehow inferior and not to be trusted. Genetics is “new” and “incomplete”. These assertions are particularly ironic as the creationsist began with an admission of and subsequently demonstrated ignorance of the subject. Not only lack of knowlege, but an admission of NOT WANTING TO KNOW- willful ignorance -

in summary creationists: don’t “DO” science

don’t value the scientific method

make assertions from fabricated authority

believe interpretations of Bible stories are more “true” then verified observations of reality

are willfully ignorant

that should be enough to convince anyone that creationism/ID has no place in the classroom as science.

Thanks for the shout-out, Dr. Hoppe. As for me, my own favorite introductory resources for understanding “genetics and evolution”, are

Volpe and Rosenbaum, Understanding Evolution 6th ed. Freeman and Herron, Evolutionary Analysis 4th ed.

And also Pearson’s “The Biology Place”, particularly its “Lab Bench” on population genetics.

http://www.phschool.com/science/bio[…]8/intro.html

Those are my chosen favorites week in and week out, thanks.

But, since you mention it, I will also glance at Dr. Noor’s thingie just to see what it is about.

FL

Oh, btw, I probably should mention that I’ve already taken Biology 150, “Evolution”, in-person in-class, at my hometown secular university. The professor was a professional tenured evolutionist.

(He was a nice atheist PhD geneticist who worked us hard but graciously gave me a “B” for the semester. It’s still on the transcript).

So I’ll probably just do like Harold and respectfully decline actually signing up fo Noor’s course.

WATCH OUT FOLKS WE GOT A BADASS

He took him a BIO 150 course at the local community college. SCIENTISTS TREMBLE IN FEAR WHEN FLAWED STARTS DISPROVING TEH EVILUTION

likewise I’m sure that people leaving Babel and entering Africa instantly or within years had become black etc. not their kids by themselves in order for their skin to deal with the sun/heat/humidity etc.

Robert, these guys descend from white Europeans who moved to Africa in the 17th Century.

Will you break the bad news to them or shall I?

Just Bob said: Huff Post:

“All that stuff I was taught about evolution and embryology and the big bang theory, all that is lies straight from the pit of Hell,” said Broun, who is an MD.

embyrology???????

He’s referring to the drawings of embryos of different species by Ernst Haeckel that exaggerated similar features. This puts his scientific training in perspective, since they date, from memory, from the 1870’s. It also indicates that he’s been receiving further instruction from creationist websites. They’re all over them.

Congressman Paul Broun (R-Ga.) said last week that evolution and the big bang theory are “lies straight from the pit of Hell.”

Regarding the topic of evolution, Broun’s statement is NOT valid, unless Evolution happens to be incompatible with Christianity.

Oh wait a minute…

http://cjonline.com/interact/blog/c[…]ons_part_two

FL :)

So what scientific breakthroughs for Young Earth Creationism and Intelligent Design has Dr Sanford accomplished since he became a Young Earth Creationist?

Not necessary to list any. The statement on the table was “I don’t see how” Sanford was a creationist. That question can be answered from ANY direction, and so it was.

Remember, the original statement was that Creationists don’t even use or value the scientific method. Heh.

You’re welocme to shift the subject, it’s a normal evo tactic, but it’s rational to at least acknowledge that the original concerns got answered.

FL

HuffPo quoted another ignorant Rethuglican:

Congressman Paul Broun (R-Ga.) said last week that evolution and the big bang theory are “lies straight from the pit of Hell.”

Then there are the Rethuglican morons from Arkansas:

Republican state representative Jon Hubbard: “…the institution of slavery that the black race has long believed to be an abomination upon its people may actually have been a blessing in disguise.” He also wrote that African-Americans were better off than they would have been had they not been captured and shipped to the United States.

House candidate Charlie Fuqua, who served in the Arkansas House from 1996 to 1998, wrote there is “no solution to the Muslim problem short of expelling all followers of the religion from the United States,” in his 2012 book, titled “God’s Law.”

See if you can convince the congressional leadership to pull him from the SCIENCE committee.

Yes, let’s have some evo-censorship, let’s have some evo-punishment.

Even though nobody is questioning the quality of Rep. Broun’s work already done in connection with that congressional committee.

Let’s face it, somebody voiced a private opinion that you don’t personally like, and now you want to do the Stalin thing on him, purge him from a governmental group where his work-quality is unquestioned. Why? Merely to punish him for voicing his own private opinion, a belief which you don’t like.

Good job Bob. You clearly don’t live in the USA, do you comrade?

FL

Speaking of candidates (and I’ve been out of the loop, so forgive me if y’all have already asked this question of Floyd) -

Floyd, do you support the candidacy of Topekan and aspiring-Westboro-Baptist-Church-member Jack Wu for the Kansas State Board of Education?

No need to dance around the answer. A simple “yes” or “no” will suffice.

FL said:

Oh wait a minute…

http://cjonline.com/interact/blog/c[…]ons_part_two

FL :)

What better proof that FL’s sectarian “religion” never converges to anything. Every place FL shows up, including his letter-to-the editor in that Topeka-Capital Journal, there is constant mud wrestling over the meanings of the meanings of the meanings of the meanings of meanings.

That is the essence of FL’s sectarianism. It is nothing but endless word-gaming; no knowledge ever comes from it. Its only purpose is to stir up rancor even as he sings praises to his own self-righteousness.

FL needs to be reminded yet again of the quantitative evidence (i.e., his cocky comments over on pages 132 to 142 of the Bathroom Wall) that he ALWAYS fakes knowledge he doesn’t have. All he has are snarky opinions and taunts.

Floyd, do you support the candidacy of Topekan and aspiring-Westboro-Baptist-Church-member Jack Wu for the Kansas State Board of Education?

Nope. I do not support Jack Wu’s candidacy, and see no chance of him winning anyway.

Instead, I have publicly called on pro-science-education Kansans to adopt new, rational, up-to-date science-standards such as those of Louisiana, Texas, and Tennessee (for example, the Louisiana Science Education Act).

See the article:

“What Are Evolutionists Afraid Of?”, June 12, 2012

http://cjonline.com/blog-post/contr[…]nists-afraid

FL

FL said:

Congressman Paul Broun (R-Ga.) said last week that evolution and the big bang theory are “lies straight from the pit of Hell.”

Regarding the topic of evolution, Broun’s statement is NOT valid, unless Evolution happens to be incompatible with Christianity.

Oh wait a minute…

http://cjonline.com/interact/blog/c[…]ons_part_two

FL :)

How do you and Paul Broun know that Christianity is not the actual lie from the pit of hell?

FL said:

So what scientific breakthroughs for Young Earth Creationism and Intelligent Design has Dr Sanford accomplished since he became a Young Earth Creationist?

Not necessary to list any. The statement on the table was “I don’t see how” Sanford was a creationist. That question can be answered from ANY direction, and so it was.

Remember, the original statement was that Creationists don’t even use or value the scientific method. Heh.

You’re welocme to shift the subject, it’s a normal evo tactic, but it’s rational to at least acknowledge that the original concerns got answered.

FL

Creationists are willing to use the scientific method, up to a point, as long as the results do not contradict whatever religious dogmas they happen to follow. The moment they stop using that method and start twisting the facts to fit their preconceptions, they commit fraud. There was no reason for Sanford to become a Creationist other than his religious bigotry.

FL said:

Yes, let’s have some evo-censorship, let’s have some evo-punishment.

Even though nobody is questioning the quality of Rep. Broun’s work already done in connection with that congressional committee.

Let’s face it, somebody voiced a private opinion that you don’t personally like, and now you want to do the Stalin thing on him, purge him from a governmental group where his work-quality is unquestioned. Why? Merely to punish him for voicing his own private opinion, a belief which you don’t like.

Good job Bob. You clearly don’t live in the USA, do you comrade?

FL

Since Broun is a liar and a fraud, his removal from the Science Committee is only a matter of integrity. Oh, you also have none, FL. You can have your own opinions, you cannot have your own facts.…not in science, anyway.

FL said:

Floyd, do you support the candidacy of Topekan and aspiring-Westboro-Baptist-Church-member Jack Wu for the Kansas State Board of Education?

Nope. I do not support Jack Wu’s candidacy, and see no chance of him winning anyway.

Instead, I have publicly called on pro-science-education Kansans to adopt new, rational, up-to-date science-standards such as those of Louisiana, Texas, and Tennessee (for example, the Louisiana Science Education Act).

See the article:

“What Are Evolutionists Afraid Of?”, June 12, 2012

http://cjonline.com/blog-post/contr[…]nists-afraid

FL

We are afraid of nothing. If you have any evidence for Creationism, present it. But you never have; you merely misrepresent evolution and lie about the supposed “evidence” you have.

What a nice bit of phony-baloney rhetoric you present. LOL!

FL said:

…I have publicly called on pro-science-education Kansans to adopt new, rational, up-to-date science-standards such as those of Louisiana, Texas, and Tennessee (for example, the Louisiana Science Education Act).

See the article:

“What Are Evolutionists Afraid Of?”, June 12, 2012

http://cjonline.com/blog-post/contr[…]nists-afraid

A far better question: Why do anti-evolutionists try to short-circuit the science process by instead appealing to politics, public relations, state legislatures/city counsels/school boards? (link here)

Also, why do anti-evolutionists remain afraid to even use the Louisiana Science Education Act since it was passed way back in 2008? (link here)

FL The Lying Hypocrite said:

So what scientific breakthroughs for Young Earth Creationism and Intelligent Design has Dr Sanford accomplished since he became a Young Earth Creationist?

Not necessary to list any.

In other words, FL, you can not list any scientific breakthroughs for Creationism or Intelligent Design because there is not a single such breakthrough to list, and you are too cowardly to admit it.

The statement on the table was “I don’t see how” Sanford was a creationist. That question can be answered from ANY direction, and so it was.

And it was discovered that Sanford stopped being a scientist when he became a creationist.

Remember, the original statement was that Creationists don’t even use or value the scientific method. Heh.

Then how come Sanford never applied the scientific method to Young Earth Creationism or Intelligent Design? Hmmmm?

You’re welocme to shift the subject, it’s a normal evo tactic,

You are hypocritically accusing us of your own dishonest tactics. And yet you complain whenever I point out that you are a Lying Asshole For Jesus.

but it’s rational to at least acknowledge that the original concerns got answered.

The original concern was never answered, hypocrite.

Tenncrain said:

FL said:

…I have publicly called on pro-science-education Kansans to adopt new, rational, up-to-date science-standards such as those of Louisiana, Texas, and Tennessee (for example, the Louisiana Science Education Act).

See the article:

“What Are Evolutionists Afraid Of?”, June 12, 2012

http://cjonline.com/blog-post/contr[…]nists-afraid

A far better question: Why do anti-evolutionists try to short-circuit the science process by instead appealing to politics, public relations, state legislatures/city counsels/school boards? (link here)

Because they have no science to use, and using the scientific method is anathema to them in the exact same way garlic and crosses are anathema to vampires.

Also, why do anti-evolutionists remain afraid to even use the Louisiana Science Education Act since it was passed way back in 2008? (link here)

Then they would be sued by the ACLU and concerned parents and teachers and create more Dover-style courtroom circuses that will focus more unwanted attention on how creationists and their political cronies are trying to destroy science education For Jesus.

FL said:

Congressman Paul Broun (R-Ga.) said last week that evolution and the big bang theory are “lies straight from the pit of Hell.”

Regarding the topic of evolution, Broun’s statement is NOT valid, unless Evolution happens to be incompatible with Christianity.

Oh wait a minute…

http://cjonline.com/interact/blog/c[…]ons_part_two

FL :)

So are you saying that the Pope and the vast majority of Christians are really devil-worshipers who hate God and Jesus?

Mike Elzinga said:

That is the essence of FL’s sectarianism. It is nothing but endless word-gaming; no knowledge ever comes from it. Its only purpose is to stir up rancor even as he sings praises to his own self-righteousness.

FL needs to be reminded yet again of the quantitative evidence (i.e., his cocky comments over on pages 132 to 142 of the Bathroom Wall) that he ALWAYS fakes knowledge he doesn’t have. All he has are snarky opinions and taunts.

Like how FL lies through his teeth about allegedly having taken a “sectarian community college science class” and somehow with the magical grace of God got a “B” in it? And then believing that this lie magically makes him smarter than all of the evil, stupid, devil-worshiping, God and Jesus-hating scientists in the whole wide world?

FL said:

So what scientific breakthroughs for Young Earth Creationism and Intelligent Design has Dr Sanford accomplished since he became a Young Earth Creationist?

Not necessary to list any. The statement on the table was “I don’t see how” Sanford was a creationist. That question can be answered from ANY direction, and so it was.

Remember, the original statement was that Creationists don’t even use or value the scientific method. Heh.

You’re welocme to shift the subject, it’s a normal evo tactic, but it’s rational to at least acknowledge that the original concerns got answered.

FL

context is your friend

in the contects of science (i.e DOING science) or science education etc - my statemnt is valid (if not elegantly phrased) howver considering the context of where/when I made those statements the contect is clear. Your counter example actually supports my thesis - as pointed out by otheres here, Dr. Sanford STOPPED DOING SCIENCE AROUND THE TIME HE BECAME A CREATIONIST - t is reasonable to conclude that the two facts might be linked in some way. Q.E.D.

FL said:

Floyd, do you support the candidacy of Topekan and aspiring-Westboro-Baptist-Church-member Jack Wu for the Kansas State Board of Education?

Nope. I do not support Jack Wu’s candidacy, and see no chance of him winning anyway.

Instead, I have publicly called on pro-science-education Kansans to adopt new, rational, up-to-date science-standards such as those of Louisiana, Texas, and Tennessee (for example, the Louisiana Science Education Act).

See the article:

“What Are Evolutionists Afraid Of?”, June 12, 2012

http://cjonline.com/blog-post/contr[…]nists-afraid

FL

new rational up to date science stardards in Texas? Tennessee? Louisiana? your model example is LSEA? what kind of Bizzaro world are you from that you insist in saying the opposite of what is factual?

LSEA would let a teacher teach whatever he/she wanted - it is the opposite of a STANDARD. It’s a cloaked endorsement of religious indoctrination- it’s one of the reasons that scientific organizations are changing locations of national meetings and conventions from New Orleans to someplace that isn’t advocating that science education become bereft of science or education. Texas if anything is worse and TN. isn’t much better - you want a model - how about Mass.? (where Gov. Rmoney is from? (not a typo))

Acutally, the LSEA calls for science teachers to go up the chain of command–school admins, local school board, then state board – and submit at each stage a request to present the critical-thinking-or-questioning new class materials. Each stage must give their permission.

THEN if all the stages say okay, the teacher can present the new material for their class for learning and discussion, without endangering their jobs. I’ts a pretty solid setup for all sides.

Remember all that evo talk about “Dover Trap”? Never happened. “Repeal”? HEH! Never happened. Even the Louisiana ACLU was forced to admit that they couldn’t do a lawsuit on LSEA as currently written.

LSEA – Never teach science without it!!!

FL :)

FL said:

Acutally, the LSEA calls for science teachers to go up the chain of command–school admins, local school board, then state board – and submit at each stage a request to present the critical-thinking-or-questioning new class materials. Each stage must give their permission.

This presumes that science teachers KNOW MORE ABOUT SCIENCE, BIOLOGY AND EVOLUTION THAN RESEARCHERS THAT INVESTIGATE THOSE SUBJECTS FOR A LIVING DO.

THEN if all the stages say okay, the teacher can present the new material for their class for learning and discussion, without endangering their jobs. I’ts a pretty solid setup for all sides.

As if IDiots and creationuts could EVER present anything that would get very far.

REAL subjects adequate for discussion would not need to go through all this rigamarole - it is just a flaccid attempt to insert Magical Skymanism into science classes.

Remember all that evo talk about “Dover Trap”? Never happened. “Repeal”? HEH! Never happened. Even the Louisiana ACLU was forced to admit that they couldn’t do a lawsuit on LSEA as currently written.

The reason a ‘Dover Trap’ never happened is BECAUSE THE LSEA WAS NEVER IMPLEMENTED. You’e kinda like a boxer that has never stepped into the ring bragging that he has never been knocked out or lost a fight.

REAL science does not require legal shenanigans to get into science courses - IF the IDiots and creationuts HAVE something, they should present it.

But all they’ve got (and all they’ve ever had) is willful ignorance and misrepresentations of reality.

If REAL scientists didn’t do research, the IDiots and creationuts would have next to nothing to lie about to support their ‘ideas’.

LSEA – Never teach science without it!!!

FL :)

The reality-based community has been teaching science quite well for centuries without the LSEA, and has been doing quite well.

The ignorance and fantasy-based communities, on the other hand, have suffered defeat after defeat after defeat.

Which may explain why they are going the ‘we shall use laws to force our idiocies and willful ignorance upon the children BEFORE they are smart enough to recognize our crap for what it truly is !’ route.

FL said:

Floyd, do you support the candidacy of Topekan and aspiring-Westboro-Baptist-Church-member Jack Wu for the Kansas State Board of Education?

Nope. I do not support Jack Wu’s candidacy, and see no chance of him winning anyway.

So you are pitching Wu? Good to know.

Creationist’s critical thinking; a prime example of GIGO.

“sectarian community college science class”

Stanton, I said secular hometown universtiy (not sectarian, not community college), in person in class for semester-long credits, Biology 150 “Evolution.”

I’m not trying to rehash that issue. I only mentioned it at all, to provide the specific reason why I was declining Noor’s online intro class.

Christian or otherwise, you must be full of anger for some reason, to so directly and blatantly misrepresent what I originally said. May I ask what that reason is?

FL

This idiot takes an introductory biology class, obviously doesn’t learn shit, then spends the rest of his life inflicting others with his ignorance of biology in an attempt to destroy their faith.

What the hell is he doing off of the BW, again?

https://me.yahoo.com/a/KirCgV93wJhL[…]I4xKqx#26847 said:

This idiot takes an introductory biology class, obviously doesn’t learn shit, then spends the rest of his life inflicting others with his ignorance of biology in an attempt to destroy their faith.

What the hell is he doing off of the BW, again?

Oh, and he learned all about thermodynamics too. Just go over to pages 132 through 142 over on the Bathroom Wall and look how he showed us, he did. He quoted a formula from a physics textbook and “proved” to us that he knows all about entropy. OOOOO!!

That seems to be a common trait of people like FL; they just happen to be experts in everything at just the right time.

Why FL even proved that faith healing is true because he saw in on the TV program Unsolved Mysteries. OOOOO!!!! With an education like that, why he can break all of us with his little pinky! Be afraid; be very, very afraid!

He has to get his jollies over here on Panda’s Thumb because apparently his “church” isn’t serving his “needs.” Some “church” that must be.

An Asshole For Jesus said:

“sectarian community college science class”

Stanton, I said secular hometown universtiy (not sectarian, not community college), in person in class for semester-long credits, Biology 150 “Evolution.”

From the way you talk of slander science, either you are lying out of your ass when you claim to have taken any science class at all, or your science teacher was an incompetent, brain-damaged moron who catastrophically failed in teaching you any science at all.

Did you learn that Evolution was an evil religion of evil perpetuated by evil, God-hating, devil-worshiping atheists in this alleged “university” class? Hmmmm?

I’m not trying to rehash that issue. I only mentioned it at all, to provide the specific reason why I was declining Noor’s online intro class.

Bullshit. Or, maybe it’s really because you’re just trolling, and you’re whipping out your obviously fraudulent credentials to try and boast about how magically smarter you are than all those evil, stupid, devil-worshiping atheist scientist morons.

Christian or otherwise, you must be full of anger for some reason, to so directly and blatantly misrepresent what I originally said. May I ask what that reason is?

Get off your high horse, Asshole For Jesus, the only idiots you’re fooling with your fake innocence act is yourself and the other creationist trolls. From all the lies you constantly vomit about science, I’d suspect that the last time you took a science course was in kindergarten, and that you flunked so badly you were laughed out of the school. Seriously, that you agree with the moronic Broun, why do you think you can fool us into believing that you’re even qualified to take a “university” course” in Evolution?

Furthermore, Asshole, I always direct contempt and anger towards you because you are a pompous, self-righteous Lying Asshole For Jesus who always treats me like shit for never volunteering to kiss your ass and suck on your genitals For Jesus. And then there is the fact that you revel in your abominable behavior towards us just to further irritate everyone For Jesus. So, why shouldn’t we direct contempt and anger towards you? Or, do you feel that we should reward your abuse of us, and your lies and slander with sucking on your genitals and kissing your ass For Jesus?

We’re degenerating, folks. Thanks for playing.

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This page contains a single entry by Richard B. Hoppe published on October 3, 2012 4:53 PM.

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